tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8091466292216433701.post8002697526991419427..comments2024-01-27T03:35:50.487-05:00Comments on X-Man's Comic Blog: Batman #17x-man75http://www.blogger.com/profile/10292719455945603075noreply@blogger.comBlogger8125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8091466292216433701.post-43891496325257974502013-12-08T00:42:59.214-05:002013-12-08T00:42:59.214-05:00I just wanted to say thanks to everyone, the autho...I just wanted to say thanks to everyone, the author of this article and the people that posted comments, for clearing things up for me. I just went back and reread the entire "Death of the Family" story and I finished it scratching my head wondering how the Joker could have done all that he did without actually knowing any of the bat-family's identities. But, if you look at it as a Batman-only story arc like many of you have suggested, it's clear that the Joker really doesn't know who any of them are. However, the tie-ins are what muddy the storyline and make it so hard to believe that the Joker really doesn't know who they all are. So, DotF + tie-ins = convoluted and incredulous ending to an over-hyped storyline. But DotF - tie-ins = modern Batman classicsupermanfanhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03042526748324901456noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8091466292216433701.post-27237802203047859062013-02-14T10:48:10.755-05:002013-02-14T10:48:10.755-05:00Excellent points, Cap. I think Snyder really gets...Excellent points, Cap. I think Snyder really gets to your point here with something that we haven't really discussed, namely Bruce's comment to Alfred that he hasn't killed Joker because he's afraid that he's get something worse. That really intuitively made sense to me, as a superstitious kind of guy. He's forced to dance this dance with the Joker because, if he stopped the dance, everything would just get worse.JWhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/18384937330661711685noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8091466292216433701.post-59515684842661228622013-02-14T09:58:37.240-05:002013-02-14T09:58:37.240-05:00I felt kind of the same here. I feel that at the e...I felt kind of the same here. I feel that at the end though is joker seeing bruce wayne (knowing he is batman) but not SEEING him for who he was because he doesn't care. Kick it back to the dark knight movie with Joker's ending dialogue. Something like "We were made for this, me and you. Joker was never caring to know who batman was in that movie, and that is because he didn't care. This seems to me the exact reason as to why he didn't make his way into the cave. Not that he couldn't hold on but that he didn't want to. <br /><br />I know I am rambling, but in batman year one, bats saves gordon's child (with no suit, just as bruce) and gordon claims to not be able to see him because of the glasses. However, gordon knows too, and chooses to not care, because the bat is a symbol (just as he was in TDKR movie) Also, I am not saying that this is 100 percent correct, its just what I feel snyder was going for. LOVED IT! However, i didn't read a single tie-in and I think that this felt as only a bats joker story, but I think the problem comes in where they hype was hitting and the times seemd DIRE and to end it on a "this is another joker story" note seems like it didn't do it justice, or possibly that is what makes it brilliant.In my opinion this story was showing us that there will never be a "definitive joker story" that is because there CAN'T be. The two of them were meant to be doing this, and that is why joker doesn't go after bruce himself because he loooooves the bat.<br /><br />Bill Hhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13281552208033079811noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8091466292216433701.post-14424234495961532062013-02-14T08:38:18.953-05:002013-02-14T08:38:18.953-05:00Missionary, I was wondering about that, too. Like...Missionary, I was wondering about that, too. Like, although Joker may not "know" their secret identities in a way where he would tell the world, he "knows" them enough to know to go after Barbara's mom, Haly's circus, etc. It's probably the only explanation that could reconcile the tie-in issues with the main event.<br /><br />I feel like DC has now done this twice to Snyder, saddle his story with unnecessary tie-in issues that weigh down the whole arc. "The Night of the Owls" was the moment when that story really went off the rails for me and, as you guys have said, this arc would have totally been better if it had just been contained in "Batman" as a "simple" Joker story. You almost have to hope that Snyder gets powerful enough to tell them to cut the crap!JWhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/18384937330661711685noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8091466292216433701.post-51790397590228295402013-02-13T23:22:50.205-05:002013-02-13T23:22:50.205-05:00HA! Yes, I said exactly that before you sent this...HA! Yes, I said exactly that before you sent this comment! If not for DC, and the HUGE hype, if this was ONLY in Batman, I think this would go down as a great storyline. I'm almost positive I'd feel differently about it. It's all the tie-ins that weighed it down. This was a really good issue, it really was. But I don't think this story was event-worthy.x-man75https://www.blogger.com/profile/10292719455945603075noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8091466292216433701.post-86212586771934224652013-02-13T23:19:22.464-05:002013-02-13T23:19:22.464-05:00Great minds think alike, JW! This comic was a rea...Great minds think alike, JW! This comic was a really weird one for me... In a void, on it's own, it was a really good read! I enjoyed it a lot. I loved Batman's reverse psychology on Joker, I enjoyed most of this comic. But I think you summed it up best, it WAS a victim of it's own hype(hit it right on the head with that). It WAS a non-event. If this entire story ONLY took place in Batman? If there were no tie-ins and this was simply a Batman story? I think we'd be talking about it differently. As it is, DC tried to make it bigger than it was, and it failed. For me at least, and for you I'd dare say. And IGN gives everything a 10! :P That's why I tend to stay away from there.x-man75https://www.blogger.com/profile/10292719455945603075noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8091466292216433701.post-67353587240516294802013-02-13T23:18:08.849-05:002013-02-13T23:18:08.849-05:00well in the first few pages of joker rambling he d...well in the first few pages of joker rambling he does say that behind their faces (bat family) there wasn't anything unique..and behind his face is just more grin and also that's his case for why the family meant't nothing.<br />Cutting faces off aside (which he didn't do) , it could be metaphorical meaning that he did know their true identities. <br />Also if you remove the crazy hype DC created about this series it is pretty much a classic Batman/Joker story.There's everything, the gag-their faces not really being cut off, the electric buzzer,the crowbar, the flower acid and Batman being awesome and outsmarting Joker at his own game with that bluff at the end.Also the last scenes with Joker really reminded me of Dark Knight Returns.<br />All in all it was a great story, only DC created a lotta hype and gave it event status.<br />Missionaryhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04922364789616959021noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8091466292216433701.post-20061170807829139452013-02-13T22:26:30.023-05:002013-02-13T22:26:30.023-05:00Dude, I had the same exact reactions. Like, exact...Dude, I had the same exact reactions. Like, exactly. The pacing was amazing, the script was spectacular, the art was awesome. But, meh. Why would the Bat-family care what Joker said to them? They know he's crazy. Plus, sure, they're mad at Bruce for not telling them that Joker might know their identities, but, in the end, he wound up being correct that Joker didn't know. So, why be mad? He was right! My biggest complaint of course is the secret identity issue because, like you said, they essentially made the back-up story from "RHatO" cannon and it is literally not possible that Joker "created" Jason but didn't know his identity. Not possible. I mean, don't get me wrong: my heart effing raced when I saw the Bat-family's faces on the platters and I effing loved Bruce taunting Joker in the cave. But, this whole event was a non-event, a victim of the hype. I can't believe IGN gave it a 10. I'd give this issue an 8, maybe, but the whole arc a 6.JWhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/18384937330661711685noreply@blogger.com